I know we've done this before, but I think my rankings have changed some since we last did this.
1. Minnesota
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2. Northwestern (pompous, but just so bad at sports they're lovable)
3. Illinois (good school, great campus, democratic state, great colors, offensive mascot & nickname)
4. Michigan State (fans are pretty nice, the same with all schools above; just all around inoffensive and slightly likable in every way)
5. Penn State
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6. Indiana (hate the school and state, but I like em in football because they've sucked for so long...I root for em)
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7. Ohio State (meh, dont knoe how to feel; jerk fans though)
8. Purdue (I hate Purdue for reasons that are unclear even to me, I think its Joe Tiller)
9. Michigan (hate em!)
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10. Iowa (terrible fans, school, and state)
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11. Wisconsin (most hated team of all, no words)
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13 comments:
My list of teams has changed little over the years and I suspect it will not change much in the future. However, I should qualify this list with a reminder that this is assuming all things are equal. Often I will cheer for a team low on my list in a certain game because I believe their success may help the gophers or produce some other desired outcome. With that in mind here is my "list in a vacuum."
1 Minnesota - the curse of my life
2 Northwestern- I understand the private school hating, but I guess to me in sports they are the poor and lowly- the classic underdog- and I like the purple colors and old 1970s mascot picture-best in the BT ever!
3 Wisconsin - I know that I am in the minority among gopher fans in this case. The conventional wisdom says I should despise them- the hated rivals to the east. But growing up Wisconsin sucked and they were even worse than Minn in the 80s. I was thrilled when they won the BT in 93 (honestly) and while I admit that my enthusiasm for them has diminished after a decade of losing to them, I still like them and want Wisconsin to do well-just maybe lose to Minn a little more.
4 Michigan State _ the first three teams are my clear top level but now it gets a little fuzzier. I like the campus, I like their colors and logo and for a long time in the 80s they were the only significant challenge to Michigan and Ohio State. Oh, and their stadium is one of the best in the BT-up close to the field.
5 Michigan - Surprise! As much as I like to beat them and as much as I curse them, I must admit that they have great colors, a distinctive helmet, a nice campus, and players like Anthony Carter, who I adored as a child. Of course, I cheer for every team on this list to beat Michigan during the season but that is only because they always win. The secret truth is that I like Michigan more than most teams in the BT- Shhhh - forget I said that- those fuckers!
6 Penn State - Could be higher but I do not regard them as a "true" member of the conference. Hate their helmets, but my god their stadium is unreal! Sitting on top of a hill - incredible! Great fans- know more about gopher football history than most gopher fans and the best college football atmosphere in the conference- its not a corporate crowd like michigan or a drunk crowd like Wisconsin- it is a pure college football loving group. Hard to cheer against them
7 Illinois - This is a team that I just can't fall in love with for some reason. Leaving the mascot out of it, I still cannot muster up more than a "their OK" I guess I find them boring- their helmet, their players, and their school is nothing special to me.
8 Ohio State - Here starts the group I do not like. OSU is just too much of a southern school for me. I feel like they belong in the SEC or something. Don't get me wrong, I still like them better than most teams in the land but they have a Glen Mason personality that rubs me the wrong way.
9 Indiana - A southern school for sure. I like nothing about Indiana . The only reason they are this high is that I just hate the other two teams more. I do feel a bit sorry for Indiana suffering so long in football but that would disappear quickly I think.
10 Purdue - The arm pit of America. Its a shitty tech school, their coach and fans are jerks, their colors suck, I hate their coach and they are in Indiana. Horrible team!
11 Iowa - Notice that teams with lots of black as part of their color scheme are evil! I think I like Notre Dame more than Iowa- that should tell you how much I hate them. Yes, I cannot think of one team I would want Iowa to beat in the nation- so they are my least favorite team in the country!
The bottom of the barrel in college football:
108. Wisconsin
109. Georgia
110. Ole Miss
111. Nebraska
112. Florida State
113. South Carolina
114. Oklahoma
115. Auburn
116. Alabama
117. BYU
118. Miami
119. Notre Dame
My standing haven't changed much either, but some of the middle ground teams have moved up or down, largely based on their success of lack thereof over the past number of years and my empathy for them. I also tend to gravitate towards the teams that I've gone to games to, or broken into their stadium higher. Having a Waffle House in their home state also draws consideration.
1-MN
2-Whisky
3a-Illinois/3b Northwestern tied (the Illini have really moved up one or two spots despite their mascot. Also public over private institution)
4-Michigan State
5-Michigan
6-Indiana (Waffle House and cute female cops)
7-Penn State (if they weren't so new to the Big Ten and if Paterno wasn't such a pig Repulican't I'd rate them higher, but still like them, although hate the uniforms)
8-Ohio Sate (at 8, I still like them although their fans can burn in hell)
9-Purdue
10-Iowa
I still can't whip up hatred for any Big Ten teams. I tried. There are teams that might annoy me, or coaches, but really just don't hate any. But I'll try:
1 Wisconsin (You know they play on a Civil War training ground)
2 Michigan
3 Illinois
4 Penn State (I have a lot of respect for Shawn having them so low because Paterno is a Republican but I have to admire a place that has had their coach for 41 years)
5 Minnesota (Mason really started to get on my nerves)
6 Iowa
7 MSU
8 Indiana
9 OSU
10 Purdue
11 Northwestern (Private School)
After Wisconsin and Michigan, it's pretty much a jumble.
So it seems like we agree on:
-we have Illinois fairly high
-we have Purdue and Ohio St pretty low
.....and thats about it. Jay: why do you have Minnesota so low? I know Mason was annoying, but it is your 2nd school! ...and you live here! At least get us ahead of Penn State.
I was more of a Gopher fan and Viking fan before I came to Minnesota.
It is no surprise that I consider myself as something of a high-minded individual, and generally I try to avoid hating another team because I was not born where they play. The closest thing I really come to hating a rival team is the Chicago Bears. I certainly hated the Bears when I was younger. But even with the Bears I ended up pulling for them in the Super Bowl last year.
However, since being here, it has been difficult to avoid rabid Minnesota fans (not the Gopher 3!) who hate the teams I like. It is hard, in the face of that, to not respond with some emotional vitriol. That level of discourse stimulates the portion of the brain where when Homer was getting the crayon reinserted he chanted D-Fense. This actually occurred more with Viking fans but some of that anti-Viking feeling has rubbed off on Minnesota. I try to keep pulling for Goldie but I have to admit that some of my goodwill towards them has been eroded.
That was my exact experience with the Badgers. They were always my second favorite team int he Big Ten and country until I got older and experienced many ugly, mean, and nasty wisky fans at gopher games. Then when I started going to Madison to visit Burt and Katie, I really saw the true colors of the drunken idiots in Madison and my hatred grew to its current levels!! If I was living in Ohio or Michigan then Wisconsin would probably be viewed very differently.
When Wisconsin won that game on the blocked punt.....I've never been treated so badly by opposing fans, especially considering that we were the home team. Well, except when I was in Madison....
Going to games is a very different experience than watching them in the comfort of your home.
But there are many other fans that are nice, cordial, and dont drunkenly get in your face. Michigan State and Penn State have great fans. Ohio State really isnt that bad either, which is surprising for a school that wins as much as they do. Obvously Northwestern, Illinois, and Indiana fans easy going, as they suck. But even when we've lost to them on the road their fans have been nice. Oh, and Purdue fans are okay I guess, but I dont like em.....my GOD, my hatred of Purdue is at an all-time high!
BTW, nice Homer "crayon-in-brain" reference.
I am still not clear on why you drop Minnesota so low Jay. Is it the viking fans that turn you against the gophers? Is it Mason? Is it Willie Middlebrooks blowing off your class? I mean I can understand WIsc and Michigan ahead of Minnesota for you-I know you have a crush on the blue, but PSU and Illinois? The mascot alone should push Ill to the 5th spot.
And you can correct me if I am wrong but I think that the biggest difference between jay and the gopher 3 in rooting for teams is that Jay does not admire the underdog as much as we do. I am not saying that he will not cheer for the underdog but he can tolerate only so much underdog. My sense is that he is likes to watch good players more than big upsets.
And I am not suggesting this is true of Jay, but the discussion reminded me that for years when I was growing up I could never understand why people- who lived in the state and should like the gophers hated them so much. It seemed ridiculous to me to dislike a team that always lost. I could not figure out why the gophers evoked so much bashing and not more sympathy. In a larger sense I could not understand rooting against any team that had a long record of losing and suffering-it just seemed like such a viscious attitude. I still cannot understand that thinking-its completely foreign to me, but I do recognize now that people often hate teams that lose. People want to be associated with teams that make them feel good (understandable) and the gophers make most Minnesotans feel bad. But rather than stick with the team when they are down it is easier to hate them, take pleasure in their defeat, and throw your support to a better team. I guess everybody hates the poor whether it is in life or in sports. Anyway, I guess my point is that when you are a long suffering gopher fan you tend to root for teams like Iowa state in other conferences and sports because they are the gophers of their league and when they succeed you are happy for their fans and program as you hope they would be happy for you too in that situation. Its kind of like an imagined brotherhood of college sports losers. A victory for any of them is a victory for us all. The fact that one is a perennial loser is enough to get one into the brotherhood and when one of them rises, even for the briefest of moments, it feels like some justice has been done not only for that team but by extension for the gophers and us as fans- its a great feeling. Go losers!
well said. Losers of the world unite!
Well, remember that my list differs from yours or Andy's, it never gets to the point of hate. I don't hate the bottom team(s) on the list. There just not my favorite.
So the reality is that Wisconsin is in a tier by itself. I do have a man crush on Michigan so they are in tier 2, I pay attention to Michigan, like the lore, 100,000+ fans at the Big House, and all that.
The next group (Il, PS, MN and (sorry) IA) are teams that I like, I want them to win, follow them. The order is not at all set in stone. Illinois may have gotten some credit for their seeming recent resurgence. I know Zook is a slimy goof who can't coach, but I liked the hire when they did it, it seems to be paying off, so Illinois ends up 3. As I said with Penn State, in a world where a coach gets a 2-3 year window to succeed, it is hard not to pull for Paterno. It won't be long and you'll miss the, "he's been coaching since the Truman administration" cliche.
And you are right, it is Viking hate that, by and large, has seeped into my Gopher rooting. I do visit the Gopher Hole to try and keep track of Gophers for the BTFFL, and I inevitably have to read about Sneaker U (yeah, there a scandal for ya), and all the rest of the vitriol that I find useless. Not that I can't participate in it when I get the chance, but I generally find the Homer Simpson Crayon in the Brain Sports Fan mentality annoying. But generally I reserve that kind of mindless hate for non Big ten teams.
You're memory is also correct on a Gopher ranking being hurt by Mason. I viewed him as a classic used car salesman coach, he ran up the score on terrible teams, gave LoMo the ball too much when he could have been giving it to MB3 and he certainly had an impact on my view of the Gophers.
But in the end a ranking of 5th is not low on my list. You're really talking about being in a tier just below my two favorite teams in college football.
As to good teams v underdogs, it is true that when I watch sports I enjoy watching the best players play well. But I pull for the underdog as much as the next guy, provided they are not playing against a team that I like and want to win.
Again, that doesn't generally apply to the Big Ten, in large part because of the Badgers. In the Big ten, I tend to pull for whoever will help the Badgers the most. And, in the case of football, I have no interest in perennially bad teams being good when the Badgers are good. I want the Badgers to be undefeated, and Michigan and Ohio State to 1 and 2 losses, each having lost to the Badgers. That is the best case scenario for the Badgers. I don't want the Badgers winning the Big Ten and have to hear announcers talk about how the Badgers are winning the Big Ten but its a down year for Michigan and Ohio State so of course someone had to win, why not the Badgers.
But I do pull for underdogs. Almost all the time. I think much of this comes back to the ISU discussion. I have no interest in ISU in the same way I have little interest in say Arizona State. If the do well, I might take an interest in them, if I tune into a PAC-10 game where ASU is beating USC, of course I'll pull for ASU. If ISU is beating Nebraska, of course I'll be happy. But I'm not going to follow a bad program in a conference I hate that I have no personal connection to. Who knows, maybe a few more years of BTFFL will bring me around to that.
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